russia? well, it depends on what, what's your initial of june the apartment and if it's good or bad, for example, in nature or in european union, we have big countries and small countries like, i don't know, france is much larger than belgium, but the members of the same my legs and i don't think they see each other's a threat. so at the moment, i would say live there, i know any formal or official these bones between the russian and chinese interests. for example, sean chi corporation organization, the russia and china, they contributed to the budget, the same amount of money, while other countries pay less. and it is very strictly observed in any tree committed to russia and china. the equality principle. also, if we're talking about the some countries dependent on another, it basically means that the other one makes the country do something that doesn't like this does not exist in the russian chinese partnership. but saying this, we can say also this chinese a much larger country in terms

are they taking russia more seriously because of the russia china relationship that is growing because i think that's the case. part of it, part of it, part of it. for sure. yes for sure. or let me listen is let me go to john in israel here. i mean, we just heard from luncheon that you know, the, the american, so take russia very seriously, but they don't, they can't seem to stop talking about russia every single day. i mean, you, it's like keystone cops and james bond. you can have them both at the same time. they are obsessed with russia, but they are beginning to really fear china. and because of their, their projection again smote both it's help bring the 2 countries together, which makes perfect logical sense to me, go ahead, john and israel. well, in the us, it was a battle most rival standby to some extent. so, you know, this attitude was long time over time to come to realize that somebody cannot be perspective on the national perspective. china is very rapidly in terms of g t. p, for example, trying today is about 70 percent of us. washer is very small and there's a famous say

what kind of russia i do represent, it is sovereign russia. russia, which is trying to defend its own interests and it will continue to strengthen sovereignty because it is most important to do in this world. we protect the interests of our people, and we protect our economy and our sovereignty. no mention of freedom or democracy in that answer, but a big mention of protecting your interests and sovereignty. just as we end this interview, i want to reflect very quickly on climate change. there's a big world conference looming in glasgow, cop26, where nations are going to gather to repeat and expand on their commitments to decarbonise. russia, it seems, protecting its sovereignty and its national interest isn't prepared to go along with that message. why not? we are preparing. we are defending our freedom and democracy, and our understanding... your freedom to continue to base your economy on fossilfuels. but that's very short—sighted... no, no, no. ..ambassador? you should better source it. you are really well prepared for that, but probably

and the us every turn offloads, this liberating and so for russia, but this one effort by russia to reduce its reliance on energy transferred through ukraine is deemed to be criminal. and again, consensus across the board. this makes perfect sense is, is quite extraordinary where this comes from him. ok, let's, let's take these, the, the nato argument, you know, needs this, this is a win for, he needs the money. ok, as if other countries don't want russian gas because they do. so i mean, if it is so very, very important to the kremlin, why would they cut off the supply? see that their logic just fails on every single metric? go ahead. oh, yes, i agree with what glen just also because okay, let's take the figures. ukraine gets real rush and friendship between $2.00 and $3000000000.00 a year. sorry about the duration of your credit was near 50000000. it was 4948. now it's less than 40 of people went to work in russia and the european union. well, the g and glad whole reduces the population, but still it's a big country, it's bigger than poland. if it is, of course, bigger than hungry and che

russia, russia, russia was a stick to beat up on donald trump, and the substance of it didn't matter. and so the senator from connecticut said, well, gosh, donald trump, he thinks, was terrible on russia. here is a simple fact -- under president trump, we stopped the pipeline. the day this sanctions legislation was signed into law. under president biden, putin began building the pipeline again. those are facts. you want to talk about who's weak on russia, those are simple facts. and those facts are dangerous. because joe biden's giving a multibillion-dollar gift of vladimir putin was a generational geopolitical mistake because it strengthens russia and it weakens america because it endangers suft national security -- u.s. national security interests. i object. the presiding officer: objection is heard. the senator from connecticut. mr. murphy: mr. president, because america national security is gravely compromised by the inability of a president to have his national security team in place at a time of crisis, i would ask that it be in order to make the same request with respect to exe

russia by europe, basically before moscow. that's also not that bad because there's this so bad idea that russia should build bridges with europe. try and push the americans out. do something from monday to do and establish time with germany and primarily, but with all the other european countries. that's kind of very close partnership. that's not very working out, but then the commercial part of it. and then of course, the problem of ukraine, which right now finds itself in a position where moscow at will if it wishes to just continue to supplied gas to europe. so far we've contract that brigade, sions, but it's not sending much or at all through ukraine. and that's for sure, let's, let's talk a little bit more about ukraine's options here. michael garcia, if ukraine continues to feel that europe in the united states are not looking out for them on this issue. does that risk join them closer to china's or bit as has been suggested by some? yeah, absolutely. i think the feeling in ukraine is i've recently returned from there i

is the china russia alliance made in america? ah, ah, cross talking russia china relations. i'm joined by my guess lynch and she yang in geneva. he is a professor of international history and politics at the graduate institute of international and development studies engineer. but in israel we have john gong. he is a professor at the university of international business in economics. and here in moscow were joined by alexander luke, and he is head of the department of international relations at the higher school of economics. or tell me in cross talk roles. and in fact, that means you can jump in anytime you want. and i always appreciated when she and jenny, but let me go to you 1st year. i've been observing it for many, many years, the growing relationship closer, relationship that russia and china had. and it was, you know, a few years ago it was murmurings people met and mentioned in western media. and now all of a sudden they're in panic mode. is it best suddenly happened? well, this hasn't suddenly happened. it's been happening for a very long time. and this, russia gav

supply, which means europe teams to cut her lines on russia. well, the russia, ukraine, unreliable transit state and would like douglas reliable? it's this, this is not. but again, this is interpretive of an energy weapon. if they deny ukraine, they're right. the transit because they have this device right to have russian gas goes through their territory. and it's, it's quite extraordinary and even make it worse. over the years, ukraine has made great attempts to cut all social and economic ties to russia to reduce all dependents on ross. i mean, ever seen binding its books, the stopping flies across the board, and the us every turn offloads this liberating and so for russia. but this one effort by russia to reduce its reliance on energy transferred through ukraine is deemed to be criminal. and again, a consensus across the board. this makes perfect sense is, is quite extraordinary where this comes from. it. ok, let's, let's take these, the, the nato argument, you know, needs this, this is a win for, he needs the money. ok as if other countries

russia has been punished. _ sochi. russia has been punished. but - sochi. russia has been punished. but for - sochi. russia has been punished. but for the l sochi. russia has been - punished. but for the olympians like yevgehy _ punished. but for the olympians like yevgeny do _ punished. but for the olympians like yevgeny do not _ punished. but for the olympians like yevgeny do not think- like yevgeny do not think russia got off lightly, because its reputation is now in tatters. its reputation is now in tattere— its reputation is now in tatters. . . . its reputation is now in tatters. ., . ., ., tatters. we are cleaning and cleanin: tatters. we are cleaning and cleaning and _ tatters. we are cleaning and cleaning and cleaning - tatters. we are cleaning and cleaning and cleaning sport, j cleaning and cleaning sport, and the people around, i mean, the other countries, they told them that we are not clean, it is not fair. we are cleaning the sport already seven years, and still we get discrimination. ,, ., discrimination. the russian government _ discrimination. the russian governmen

is quite an absurd argument against russia has any will. first of all, this pipeline makes perfect economic sense. the fact that we have to pay the billions of dollars every year to the greens means about the german. then the rest of that something again from, from, from cutting out the middle and, but also it makes much more reliable. and this is why the germans initiated, but still they use pushing with arguments of russia unreliable supply, which means europe teams to cut her lines on russia. well, the russia, ukraine, unreliable transit state and would like douglas reliable, it's so this, this is not. but again, this is interpretive of an energy weapon if they deny ukraine their rights of transit because they have this divine right to have russian gas goes through their territory. and it's quite extraordinary and even make it worse. over the past the years, ukraine has made great attempts to cut all social and economic ties to russia to reduce all dependence on russia. mean, ever since binding its books, the stopping flies across the bo

, something that russia doesn't feel is just and doesn't feel it's right than russia and moscow reserve the right to respond accordingly to basically mirror the actions and do something very, very similar. so this is what the russian foreign ministry is saying happening with . well, sarah range forward. according to the russian foreign ministry, several russian journalists back in 2019, failed to get work visas in the u. k. but one of them, for example, didn't, i didn't have the visa renewed and another one simply didn't get one at all. and so for the past several years since 2019 the russian foreign ministry, russian diplomats have been pointing at these situations to the u. k. authorities saying that this wasn't right, but that all, all of that i should say fell on deaf ears. and so russia has decided to take this step. at least this is the position of the russian foreign ministry. and of course, the b, b. c is quite better, they've called this step and attack on the freedom of press. they've also called this. they've also urged the russian foreign ministry to reconsider their decisio

so, but until recently i started making claims that the german you will have to punish russia, give russia interprets the construction of a lot to him to i think i and green light for. busy for pressure in ukraine, so i don't know where the some show that you will stop because if you know so good, particularly emanating from nato. i mean they interpret this as a defeat. so i mean there's this very powerful unity, unity, unity. they keep repeating over and over. i guess there really isn't. there is also, it's really kind of laugh in a facade here at the end of the day. you need reliable, cheap energy and all of their nonsense of all their, their, their propaganda war goes into kathy's. go ahead. yeah. well, the core of this propaganda though, is if they, the key argument, which everyone agrees on which is absurd to begin with, even the germans in american will agree on this, on the mental thing that they all have to preserve ukraine's rights of transit. now this is repeated over and over again. right? so that means all russian gas, the russian guess you're going right to have this transitiv

it was new relations between the west and russia. and indeed, i mean, you know, the chinese course a piece for rise of china. we are growing economically, but by not going to invade anyone by willing to have actually, i will give you mine by went to give you a unit. that was the message from chain of or did they get the return? so, i mean, if the states are so concerned about all of this live the bad publicity of the back yard, the states and there was a creation around, isn't rolling in this. i mean, the whole idea of hong kong was the other bridge between huge mainland china and the west. that's how this you to prosper. and then jillian, this, you do know the chinese, the west side and the book. and while i georgia here talking about diplomacy, you know, unfortunately they're not just, this is becoming an anti merry for the chinese also. good governance is not based on democracy as it is understand in the west. it's, it's based on the principle of choosing the best and some co chinese kind of been able to choose some very competent

russia and china — appeal to russia and china. russia and china both _ appeal to russia and china. russia and china both have _ appeal to russia and china. russia and china both have their- appeal to russia and china. russial and china both have their problems with istamic— and china both have their problems with islamic minorities _ and china both have their problems with islamic minorities and - and china both have their problems with islamic minorities and the - with islamic minorities and the taiiban— with islamic minorities and the taliban are _ with islamic minorities and the taliban are politically- with islamic minorities and the - taliban are politically manipulative and sophisticated _ taliban are politically manipulative and sophisticated enough- taliban are politically manipulative and sophisticated enough to - taliban are politically manipulative and sophisticated enough to knowl and sophisticated enough to know that and _ and sophisticated enough to know that and they _ and sophisticated enough to know that and they are _ and sophisticated enough to know that and

that often happens in today's russia. russia has both. it wants to be in some control of the european market or at least pricing there and supplies. of course, what was promised to the european market. the pipelines are tied to europe. russia is tied to europe. from moscow, that is not that bad because there is this whole idea that russia should build bridges like europe and try to push the americans out. establish a germany -- a partnership with germany and other european countries. there is the problem of ukraine which now finds itself in a position where moscow can continue to supply gas to europe to fulfill its contract obligations but not sending much or at all to the ukraine. >> sure. let's talk about ukraine's options. michael, if the ukraine continues to feel that the united states not looking out for them on this issue, does that risk them drawing closer to china? >> absently. i think the feeling in ukraine is that has been thrown under the bus. the biden administration has very few foreign policy wins and it has chosen to improv

why is russia developing this technology? the reason for rapid investments in the of in the vase in sick is actually us withdrawal from the abm treaty to the limit of missile defenses and hyper sonic weapons. i considered as a good tool to overcome any foreseeable michel defenses or take all me. so defense assets on a, dr. go scale. and now the reason why probably that was some speed up and deployment of for not yet will develop systems, is the general deterioration of military political situation? because a despite all declaim, saw, like rush and aggression, and the greatest things like that. the actual reason for that is the russian sense of will not be with russian sense of meal dream theater. that it could be, would you solve for the u. s. central with some other states. sure, evidently is a dangerous weapons. what needs to be done to ensure there isn't any proliferation in this technology? i'm afraid that if we speak about proliferation, as in the development all this weapons in other countries or selling those, the only

armenia is now asking russia to deploy troops along its border with azerbaijan. prime minister nicole peshanian says it's the only solution to allow border demarcation without further violence. russia has not made any promises yet, but the international community is urging all sides to respect the ceasefire that's in place right now. well, on thursday, a number of armenian and azeri soldiers were killed in the fighting. it happened in nagorno-karabakh, the disputed region where the countries fought a war last year. azerbaijan's defense ministry accused armenian forces of what it called provocations and said its army would continue to retaliate. so hostilities involving nagorno-karabakh go back decades. azerbaijan and armenia fought a six-year war that ended in a ceasefire in 1994. then in 2016, an outbreak of violence killed dozens of people during four days of fighting. and last year's conflict killed more than 5,000 people, including both soldiers and civilians. the conflict has regional implications, as well. russia has traditionally been an ally of armenia an

well, let me ask you specifically about russia, because russia still lists the taliban as a terrorist organization. and for the record, it's the world's deadliest group. i think almost 5000 deaths attributed to it in 2019 that's 3 times more than dash in the same year. do you think any law abiding country should be talking to terrorist or labeling any group as tara is given how politically charged that where they were, the, the, the tyler bond being listed as a terrorist by the united nation is the cause of their action. of course, and we have everybody to try to talk to them if there is no alternative because there are no alternatives things when drunk, things went wrong and he began to re merge and part of the population went with them. the answer is not continuing to fight the answers to find the solution and bring the solution. and that is what russia has done and we appreciate it and we wanted to continued in fullest. so yes, talk to them. there are some p is no other alternative. one of the reasons the kremlin is pursuing those talks is because the calculation here is that the t

that's russia. log into a central asia and doesn't want to see american soldiers since central asia. i would like to ask you to last that. i mean it's true. that's true. that's true. then what are the considerations behind day's words? and i would like to ask for the opinion of mr as he yard hill about the same matter as well. correct? because her kid to we throw all american soldier, it's about with throwing all american soldiers from santa asia. and the 2nd question about the intermediate role of the russian of dan is then in town here, there is that because at the chamber, let me, i don't better get out to, i'm going, i'm going to stand on the caves and the answer between taliban and russia russia plea, you talk about these intermediary role as well and, and garrison in this regard. and the 3rd question, the security council of the un, unable to keep them accomplished. hancock, jen, are you, do they want to come up with their new chill shared point of view regarding the dentist and they will come

and then also really kind of cornering russia, enforcing russia to do whatever nato wants. and that's been kind of the goal of the g 7 summit. they were the primary factors in all of these conversations to, to then turn around out of those conversations and kind of take your hat and put it in your hand and go back to russia and china and they will hopefully, you guys can be the ones to deal with what's happening and again, it's them because it's also be clear about this. rachel, china and russia did not go into afghanistan, 20 years ago, did not overthrow the taliban. and so china and russia have not been at war with the taliban, or at war. and afghan sand, but nato has the united states as the u. k. has the italians and the french have. and so now, because they have been embarrassed over this situation and recognize that they left essentially the country with an enormous power vacuum that was filled almost immediately. it's a pretty humbling situation to now say to you, to russia and china, who are seen as these great threats in the world. you're the only answer to bringin

it feels like today's russia is moving in reverse. laura: her final disc -- dispatch from russia. our top story tonight, president biden defended the u.s. withdrawal from afghanistan, calling the mission and extraordinary success. speaking at the white house, biden accepted responsibility for the decision to withdraw, saying it wasn't an option to stay longer. taliban fighters spent their first full day in control showing off the military gear the u.s. left behind. the images, a stark reminder of the change of power in afghanistan. i'm laura trevelyan. thanks for watching bbc world news america. ♪ narrator: funding for this presentation of this program is provided by... narrator: financial services firm, raymond james. narrator: funding was also provided by, the freeman foundation. by judy and peter blum kovler foundation; pursuing solutions for america's neglected needs. and by contributions to this pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ♪ ♪ narrator: you're watching pbs. ♪ da-da-da-duh-da-da-da♪ ♪ da-da-da-da-da-da ♪♪ captioning sponsored by newshour produ

lugovoi is hardly hiding here in russia. he did our interview in one of the restaurants that he owns. he's a member of parliament. and he's even become something of a pop culture icon. hosting his own tv show. the program program, appropriately enough, called "traitors". it names and shames individuals who are supposedly enemies of the russian state. lugovoi's high profile here is just one reason that many people who suspect him of murder don't think he acted on his own. another reason, all of the polonium 210 in russia is under the control of the state. >> it's impossible to use a state controlled substance like this without the knowledge of the very top of the country. >> because you're unleashing a radioactive substance? it's almost a tiny little dirty bomb. >> it's nuclear terrorism. >> of all his enemies, litvinenko may have infuriated one more than any other. coming up -- >> i have said that this is a very dangerous thing to do because your personalizing this. >> when "dateline" continues. how i feel ♪ ♪ breeze dri

it's importing a huge amount of all from russia. a lot of off in canada, do you think it's kind of booked itself into a corner at this point? well, we have also inflation coming up in the states. i mean, i think in the last 3 months, i heard i read somewhere with 5 or 6 percent, which is unheard of really we're talking $970.00 numbers, almost of inflation and consumer consumers are finding it difficult to get back into the economy even though we are the world is trying to read, restart the economy after and then make because basic goods are soaring and prices, and a lot of these goods are commodities. so somehow, politically speaking from the domestic point of view, whoever is in charge cannot afford, must do everything possible to lower prices at some level and be thanks to russian production. we have an alternative source which prevents fuel prices and energy prices from going even further. and pushing inflation even higher than it already is. so, apart from the sanctions, we have economic cycles and pan post pandemic recovery sit

a small state like us will remain alone against those like russia. what is your solution for those like georgia and i would throw ukraine in there as well. >> i do think that we have some obligations to think about it here in the united states because going back to the summit under president bush we promised ukraine and georgia membership but we did to say we would plan to include them. it's not something that we have to feel obliged to for any country that might wish for them. we don't have enough power to defend everyone on earth. i would have argued against that process. but i also believe that by making that promise in some ways we got the worst of the world on georgia and ukraine because putin knows we want to bring them in and therefore he tried to destabilize the country's to keep that in eligible for any near-term membership. so the only way out of this conundrum to my mind is to enlarge the conversation and allow for some new type of security order that would require putin and russia to pull the forces verifiably out of places like northern

concerns not that russia's anything to be feared from nato but we expect that russia will in fact be willing to compromise to assure the security of those countries. to the extent that russia invalidates that premise, we may have to reconsider. with compromise in an effort that means verifiable pullout of forces and then recognizing those countries have the right to join any other organization if they wish. >> that russia will backed up because we have gone from where we were 25 years ago to on the border. >> i don't want to blame us too much but russian pride and human beings will have a natural adverse reaction to those extending to your doorstep that putin didn't have to aggress against these countries are squelch opposition or act as he did or threatened more against nato. michelle had to deal with this in a way that western lives were at risk because of russian behavior i will not defend putin just because we have been offputting in his mind with the expansion of nato but now is 30 members enough? >> the next question from the vietnamese presences is from the undersecretary of d

would european perceptions be weak when it comes to russia? well, without a strong leadership from germany, france will probably try to double down as the voice of engagement and likely be joined by italy in that regard. we even saw that on the canister crisis, student in the italy and student and macro really engaging quite closely. so i think that that will probably happen. and yes, if germany now adored stream to kind of a dollar, more of a conciliatory posturing towards russia does have a clear strategy more rely on the united states. and this might also give britain now an opportunity to kind of straddle between the u. s. in europe. and adopted more hawkish, fostering to i think we should look at british policy as well. busy as american barza, and that's an area in the past few weeks, i've been sort of investigating, you might say a range of opinions about the position of the u. s. for example, the secretary state and the defense secretary there have been garnering support from either the european community or the asia pacific political c

china and russia are happy to see the west's defeat. but with the afghan security first -- forces gone, the terrain where al qaeda had training camps belongs to the taliban again, a new homeland for islamic extremism and if it spills out of afghanistan, it's a truly global threat. >> let's explore more deeply one of the countries that caroline examined there. russia says they remain committed to acting as a mediator to maintain peace in the region. speaking in a visit, lavrov said that they oppose the idea of allowing afghan refugees to enter. steve rosenberg has more now on that you of the unfolding crisis . >> the russian state media, there has been a certain amount of gloating over what's happening in afghanistan and over the unraveling exit strategy of the united states. it's if you heard quite a lot from commentators and tv anchors here. that back in 1989 when soviet troops pulled out, the withdrawal was much more orderly and the pro-moscow afghan government left behind then lasted for three years before it fell. as one russian new

we are seeking to deter russia from what they're doing and ukraine. i think he has been the most revisionist leader in the world today. i disruptive, not paying attention to any of the kind of rules of the liberal international system, and then use tactics that he had used in russia against us here in the united states. president of the united states, despite all of that escalation, continues to have one consistent foreign policy. and that is, he wants to be friends with food and whether these are a genuine abuse that just happened to feed what, how talking points, or whether he is simply cashing in on anti russian rhetoric turns out even his claim to have half a 1000000 twitter followers is suspect, what's even more amusing is that nearly 40 percent of his twitter followers are fake glen dab, investigative journalist, gland, and greenville. also mark mc force as attempt to play the victim card. he was inclined to critic for putin and said he would assume he was a kremlin agent unless he immediately provided his real name. but that probably goes witho