tv Ayman MSNBC June 25, 2022 8:00pm-9:00pm PDT
i think that's what's at the heart of what is so, so maddening today. >> dahlia lithwick, senior editor and legal editor for slate dot come. dahlia, it's an important day, thanks for being with us. >> thanks, rachel. >> all right, that is going to do it for us for now. i will see you again on monday. it will be back here for the rachel maddow show monday night. i'm michael steele premium a. did not work up in the three big stories affecting you of the country. starting with the future of women's health and a post-roe word. and the other major supreme court ruling this week, overturning a century old gun the. plus trump corruption which is new levels. but we learned from this latest january six. herring let's get started. the supreme court has overturned roe v. wade, reversing nearly half a century of legal precedent and ending
american women's constitutional right to abortion. justice samuel alito pending the majority opinion, joined by four other conservative justices, held that, quote, the constitution does not compare a right to abortion. roe and casey are overturned. even chief justice roberts dissented from overturning roe, saying that the court was going too far. however, he decided with the conservatives on the case at hand, upholding mississippi 15 -week abortion ban. of course, overturning roe would have an immediate impact on women across the country, particularly in 13 states with so-called trigger laws. those states have already banned abortion or will in the coming days and weeks. the institute estimates that in total, 26 states are certain or at the very least, quite likely, to ban abortions. the nationwide reaction has been immediate. thousands have gathered and and cities and towns across the country to protests. this was the scene outside the supreme court today. here is what it was like in nashville and in st. louis. justice -- in her dissent condemned the
majority decision, arguing that, quote, from the very moment of fertilization, a woman has no rights to speak of. now, other rights granted similar legal precedents will come under the microscope, thanks in part to concurring opinion from justice clarence thomas who suggested that ruling stopping states from criminalizing same-sex intimacy, banning gay marriage and eliminating access to contraception should also be, quote, reconsidered. in short, despite the fact that a drop that this opinion was leaked and may, and despite the fact that many knew this was coming, theory is different than practice. we are only just beginning to understand the sheer magnitude of how this decision will reshape america.
joining me now joyce vance, msnbc legal analyst and former u.s. attorney, professor at the university of alabama law school and co-host of the sisters and law podcasts. sarah who are bellow, legal director of the human rights campaign and jennifer burr in, contributor to washington monthly. joyce, let's start with you, what was your reaction to the legal reasoning that the justice have set forth in the opinion? >> we knew that this outcome was coming. that seemed to be preordained once we saw the supreme court say hands off on the texas law that prevented vigilante justice. what is really shocking when we saw the leaked draft opinion, and when you read this opinion, which is now the law in this country, is how results oriented the jurisprudence the supreme court uses to reach the outcome that there is no constitutional protection for
abortion. it is maybe the most shocking feature of the opinion. i know you have seen this, michael, it is justice alito's reliance on a 17th century british jewish prudential expert, a man that ruled in cases where witches were hanged. a man he believed was not possible for a husband trip his wife. this discredited jurisprudence from an era where women had no rights that justice alito uses to condemn women today to a similar fate. >> sarah, how did you assess the justices ruling here? >> when we are looking at this from the launch of the lgbtq community, the majority opinion goes out of its way to say that the this issue to strike down roe will not have an impact on any other case law, including the right to contraception, the right to same sex intimacy and the red to marriage. however, justice thomas is inviting challenges in the way
that he frames his concurrence. he essentially says that all of these laws are no longer valid and the way that the court as struck down the due process analysis. he wants to see this court reevaluate each in every one of those decisions. >> jennifer, you came at this from a different perspective, a personal one. you wrote a personal piece on abortion for washington monthly just before the decision. what did you say in that piece, and how the now that we had this ruling, how have your reflections come out on this? how do you see this right now? >> i wrote the piece because back in december, i took a friend from texas to planned parenthood and baltimore for an abortion. she was denied an abortion in texas so i took her, i spent the day with her at planned parenthood. as every hour went on, i just
got more and more upset and outrage that a woman had to fly halfway across the country for a medical procedure that should just be status quo everywhere. it made me reflect on my own abortion that had when i was 40, a single mom with two kids. i just think that this decision is so shameful and outrageous that i cannot believe that we are going back to a time where we are going to have unsafe abortions all across the country. it is shameful. >> joyce, that raises a broader and more interesting point because you have justice thomas who has laid down a marker, you must get the sense that he was saying on emerging troops of folks out there to send us the case and we are going to deal with -- reconsider cases like griswold, lawrence and obergefell, is that a correct interpretation? how do you see this from a justice perspective? >> he has issued an engraved invitation to conservative forces to repeat the strategy that was used for 50 years. a strategy that republicans
pursued with patience and persistence to get to where we are today on abortion. the reason that has some vitality is because substantive due process is the legal principle from which all of these rights are derived. the previous right to abortion services and now obergefell, lawrence, griswold versus connecticut, the contraception case, the notion being that there are some rights that are so foundational that you have a right to be protected from the government interfering with those rights. clarence thomas believes that's malarkey. he thinks that there is no such thing as substantive due process. he called it an oxymoron in his concurring opinion. he essentially invited future litigants to bring challenges. that is exactly what we saw with abortion, where you will see states passed state
legislators passing laws that they knew would not go into effect because they were unconstitutional, but they wanted to stack them up, case after case, looking for the case that would finally break through and permit the supreme court to reverse itself. that is what justice thomas is asking for. i guess the good news is that he did not get a single justice to join his concurrence. frankly, he was an outlier on the abortion issue. he is always been an outlier on supplanted due process, and there is no reason to believe he will not continue to work. he is giving encouragement to conservative lawyers across the country to bring these challenges. >> sarah, we heard a little bit about what jennifer had to say in terms of her personal journey on this, what would be your advice to women at this time? as the settles in across the country in the next few weeks and months, and years, likely, how should this be absorbed by women in the country? >> two fold, one, to understand what your rights are now, understand where abortion is already illegal, as of this
moment. understand where abortion is legal and what the restrictions are, even in those places where abortion is legal, so that you understand your full scope of options. if you are fortunate enough to work for an employer that will pay for travel services for you and independent, how that information at hand and continue to show up, continue to speak out and march. the only way to change his country is to demonstrate that this is not supported by a majority of americans. >> jennifer, what is your message to young girls, particularly given the journey that you just experienced with a friend, what does a 12, 13, 17-year-old girl think about
this or should think about with this all means? >> i think exactly what sarah just said, we have got to fight back, we can be said, we can be mad, but we have got to buy back right now. women need to know their rights, and they need to fight for them. roe is on the ballot in november. make no mistake. young women, especially, need to go out and vote for legislators, senators, congressman, who believe in upholding this very important, fundamental right for women. i think the sars point, nowhere resources are available. i think we will see women across the country driving and getting to places where abortion is safe and legal. i encourage it. here in maryland, for women to seek people out who will provide the resources they need
to access a safe and legal abortion. >> joyce vance, sara warbelow and jennifer bertrand, thank you each for your time. still ahead, what we learned about republicans in congress. during this week's january six hearings, it was interesting, congresswoman mary gay scanlon joins me next. joins me next. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. [submarine rising out of water] minions are bitin' today. (sung) liberty. liberty. liberty. minions: the rise of gru, in theaters july 1st. we hit the bike trails every weekend (sung) liberty. liberty. liberty. shinges doesn't care. i grow all my own vegetables shingles doesn't care. we've still got the best moves you've ever seen good for you, but shingles doesn't care. because 1 in 3 people will get shingles, you need protection. but, no matter how healthy you feel, your immune system declines as you age increasing your risk for getting shingles. so, what can protect you? shingrix protects. you can protect yourself from shingles with a vaccine proven to be over 90% effective. shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles
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contact? you >> know, she didn't contact me about it. i heard that she'd at the white house for a pardon. from mr. philbin, but i didn't frequently communicate with miss greene. >> one of the major stunning moments from this week's explosive january 6th hearings was finding out which house republican sought presidential pardons. the list included, not only marjorie taylor greene and her close friend matt gates. but for other trump allies as well. >> this is gates is personally pushing for a pardon. and was doing so since early
december. i'm not sure why. mr. gohmert acts for one as well. mr. perry asked for a pardon to, i'm sorry. >> now folks, there's only one reason to ask for a pardon. when you know you have committed a crime. the american people deserve to know why these republicans thought they needed to get out of jail free card. all six have denied any wrongdoing, of course. so far representative green, gomez, and perry, have denied seeking pardons. matt gates has not denied it. and millbrook's made no comment. although he has offered to be deposed by the committee. the other big allegation this week was senator ron johnson and ted two-handed lever fake elector documents to vice president mike pence immediately before the final vote tally was set to begin. >> a staffer for wisconsin senator, ron johnson, texted a
staffer from vice president pence just minutes before the beginning of the joint session. this staffer stated that senator johnson wish to hand deliver to the vice president the fake election was votes from michigan and wisconsin. the vice president, unambiguously, instructed him not to deliver the fake both to the vice president. >> i'm joined now by pennsylvania congressman mary gates gallant, member of the house judiciary committee. congresswoman, welcome. thank you so much. before we get into the specifics of those revelations. i am just curious. what is the vibe in the house on the other side of the aisle among your colleagues that are giving all of these revelations? the hearings now are pushing into july. the committee members continually being reminded that this is an ongoing investigation. which in my mind, suggest
expanding the investigation. so do you see any kind of nervousness among the gop members right now? are they just like whatever? >> they certainly haven't been confessing, if that's what you are asking for. although asking for pardons is pretty close to a confession. you know, we hear from the january 6th committee that they are getting more evidence. they've taken a pause in the hearing to digest some of the evidence that they have received just in the last week or so. certainly members of the committee looked very confident and they keep suggesting that there is more evidence to come that we are far from kind of bombshells here. you know, it is kind of hard to read the mood on the other side of the aisle now. some people have been quite noisy in the passing a little bit quieter. i keep harkening back to the fact that in the immediate aftermath of the invasion of the capitol i was one of 30 some odd members who had seen tours of the capital on the day or two before the insurrection. we asked the capitol police to investigate. because they're not suppose be
any tours at that time. and in order to get people in there to have it where they had to be admitted by a member or the member staff. so we clearly saw tours when we asked for that investigation. folks on the other side the aisle denied that there had been any tours. and they filed an ethics complaint against us. so they were very noisy. well of course, just last, week we found out that yes the workhorse. in fact, there is videotape of those stores. and so there's been this backtracking. so we are hearing some people be less noisy than before. but i think there is a lot more to come. >> and light of what you just said about, not just the members being a little bit more quiet, but also the report that you put in about the tours and the concern that you and other members had about that. how do you assess the revelation of the names of those so-called six gop members who sought pardons? how significant is it that mob had offered to sit in front of the general six committee?
could that spell more intrigue or trouble for donald trump? >> well certainly. mr. trump didn't demonstrate any loyalty to mr. brooks. and endorsed his opponent. of course, mr. brooks is now out of the race. so he is certainly have less incentive to be loyal to the former president, despite the personal cost at this point. but i think the big thing that we learned this week or got really highlight it was when the former president asked members of the department of justice, the leadership of the department of justice, to tell states that there had been fraudulent results in their elections and that therefore they should be reexamined them. and perhaps change their electors. those department of justice officials said no. trump then told them, look, just say it was corrupt. and the republican congressman
will do the rest. that is a pretty strong line from that to the request for pardons. >> it is. and it is going to be interesting, and addition to what we've learned that the committee and the justice department are seeking those 170 hours of footage from those pair of danish documentary filmmakers who were inside trump orbit following trump confident roger stone on january 6th. that is on top of the other footage that the committee has obtained from a different filmmaker. so, all of this is now showing itself and being revealed. is this the tip of a very large iceberg here? do you think that this is going to further extend beyond maybe july? the hearings that the committee is pursuing right now? >> i don't know. it is probably the most compelling miniseries i've ever
watched. i think the problem that the committee is struggling with is the vast quantities of information. there were thousands and thousands of hours of footage, just from the folks who invaded the capital. and from the surveillance cameras that are part of the security there. now there is more. so, the good news is, we are getting a fuller picture of exactly what had happened. and he was involved. but it does take some time to go through. >> before we go, congresswoman scanlon. i want to get your response to the roe ruling. both as a member of congress and as a member of the house judiciary committee. >> well, it is obviously very disturbing. you know, i am a female, i have a daughter. to know that she is going to have less rights than i have had for the last 50 years. that is pretty daunting. the implications of this decision for other privacy rights that are really fundamental to our american experience. i have to say that i think that
decision was wrongly decided. but that is not something that we can address with the court. because the trump supreme court is the highest court in the land at this point. so we've got work to do on the electoral front. >> congresswoman mary gay scanlon. thank you very much. we appreciate you coming out tonight. coming up, congress passed a major new gun law and the supreme court apparently didn't get the memo. what you need? like how i customized this scarf? check out this backpack i made for marco. only pay for what you need. ♪liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty.♪ now you can enjoy the best eggs in so many delicious ways. eggland's best. the farm-fresh taste you love. plus, superior nutrition. only eggland's best. ♪♪ ♪ ♪ this is the moment.
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years. the legislation provides the states to enact red flag laws, on mental health services, closes what is known as the boyfriend loophole, and requires enhanced background checks for 18 to 21-year-old. two dozen republicans across the house senate joined all democrats in supporting the bipartisan legislation. but the signing comes just after the supreme court struck down a new york gun law that restricted conceal carry of a handgun in public. joining me now is ohio congresswoman, joyce navy. chairwoman of the congressional black caucus. such a pleasure to have you on. welcome. >> thank you. it is a pleasure to be here. >> absolutely. i want to get your thoughts on this new gun legislation president biden just signed. how do you judge this new law? does it meet the moment or is it sufficient but more work to do? >> i think it does both.
i think when you look at 30 years we have been fighting against our colleagues on the other side to try to be reasonable. to help us make an attempt to save lives. is it enough? no. we would like to have had legislation that included banning assault weapons and other things. but look at this. the years. we were able to get closing the boyfriend of the. we've been working on that. we are able to get the panic the straw purchases. when you think about those things that we were able to get that we have been fighting for for so long, i think it is a great day for us. when we look at putting some 200 and $50 million into our communities to deal with community crises and interventions in our community. things that members of the congressional black caucus we've been working on this effort since i've been in congress. fighting for this.
so we hair so proud when we look at what congresswoman lucy mick back, we know she lost her precious child jordan to can violence, we look at what congresswoman robin kelly from chicago. the number of deaths that we are seeing at the hands of guns. and then congressman stephen horseman who's vice chair of the congressional black caucus and has been fighting for getting dollars to put back into our community and for mental health. so this is a big step for us. but is that the final step? absolutely not. >> let's pick up on that point. because for a lot of folks, congresswoman, this is enough. they want to see more. so it is a two part question. given the fact that a republican seat is one and done. there is no incentive for them to do anything more on guns. how do you move that needle? how do you then plan for the
future with at least one party with a party that just doesn't want to do anything at all? how do you get legislation done? >> i think that -- i look at this is a first step and a big step. many individuals but we wouldn't get this far. but here we are. i think the other thing is we will be tying it to elections. because what we are seeing between this and roe v. wade being overturned. that there are consequences of elections. and so we are getting ready for our election in november. you are going to see this out in full force us on our issues because we know we have to do what wve done in the p many individuals that 50 plus years ago we wouldn't get civil rights. we wouldn't get housing. we wouldn't get jobs. and many of the things we got. but we've got it through the ballot box. and i can tell you we are prepared. >> so congresswoman, let's turn to row.
and the decision the supreme court. and a press conference on friday speaker pelosi made a connection between the two supreme court rulings hand pointed out what she sees as hypocrisy. >> such a contradiction. yesterday, the states cannot make laws governing the constitutional right to bear arms. and today they're saying the exact reverse. that the states can overturn a constitutional right for 50 years. for women having the right to choose. the hypocrisy is raging. but the harm is endless. >> so, hypocrisy or these two very separate and different constitutional laws? >> absolutely not. it is hypocrisy at its best.
i will take it a step further. when you are doing what you are doing with the states you cannot one day say that states cannot have a right and then the next day say states can have a right. i also want to look at my republican colleagues who refuse to put money into our communities. when we were talking about build back better and helping those weather was meant to house, meant there it was the child tax credit, whether it's putting food or health care for children and families. they wanted no part of that. but yet, you want to have mandated government pregnancies and you don't want to take care of those babies. hypocrisy again. >> so congresswoman. we got this little ditty from texas senator john corman who responded to a tweet from former president barack obama. that denounce the roe v. wade decision. peng's tweet said now to plessy v. ferguson, brown versus board of education.
do you believe senator cornyn was suggesting we should reverse the board of brown versus board of education decision? what does this even mean? >> but i think what many individuals have been supportive of making sure that we maintain roe v. wade or saying if we look at what justice thomas wrote. i think he could be referencing that. he talked in his opinion. he talked about what was next. he talked about lgbtq. he talked about women's rights. he didn't talk about interracial marriages that. and at one time that was something that was off the books. but i think that many of us are afraid that this is opening pandora's box. or at least that will be their attempt. >> congresswoman joyce thank you so much for being a public conversation. tonight coming up inside trump 's pressure campaign on state and election officials.
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minions: the rise of gru, in theaters july 1st. the fourth hearing from the january six committee focused on the pressure campaign and the state of election workers and political officials. we heard how far trump and his allies went in their effort to get arizona and georgia to decertify their election results. and we also heard how trump's eyes lead to threats of violence in debt for some. >> after the election received
a phone call from president trump and rudy giuliani. and which they discuss the result of the presidential election in arizona. what was the ask during this call? >> that i would allow an official committee at the capitol so that they would hear this evidence and that we could take action thereafter. and i refused. >> one to doctor eastman want to do? >> that we would decertify the electors and that because we have plenary authority to do so. and he said, just do it and let the court soldiers out. >> did you also receive a call from u.s. representative andy biggs of arizona on the morning of january 6th? >> i did. >> with mr. big thank you to do? >> he asked if i would sign on both to a letter that been sent from my state and or that i would support the certification of the electors.
i said i would. not >> would happen in the fall of 2020 is that 20,000 georgians did the presidential race and they voted down ballot to know the races. and the republican congressman and it of getting 33,000 more votes than president trump. that's why president trump came up short. >> secretaries are in with a could lawfully change result in the state of georgia and somehow explained it away as a recalculation? >> know the numbers are the numbers. the numbers don't lie. we have many allegations that we investigate every single one of them. and that jasmine team that we miss anything? >> i don't twitter, and i spoke to, and seeing months time. there's a particular tweet that for the better work was a straw that broke the camel's back. it had his name. you committed treason. may got have mercy on your soul. with a slowly twisting gift of
a noose. and for lack of a better word i lost it. i just got high right. >> after may display to the president that donald trump urges supporters to avoid the use of violence? >> not to my knowledge. >> i went to the facebook app and i'm just kind of panicky at this point because this has never happened to me. i went to that icon and it was just a lot of horrible things there. >> and those horrible things they include threats? >> yes. a lot of threats. wishing death upon me. telling me that i'll be in jail with my mother and saying things like because it is 2020 and not 1920. yeah. >> for a lot of these threats and vile comments racist in nature? >> a lot of them were racist. a lot of them were just hateful. but yes sir. >> there is no where i feel safe. nowhere. do you know how it feels to have the president of the united states targeting you. the presence of the united
states is supposed to represent every american. not to target one. but he targeted me. lady ruby. a small business owner, a mother, a proud american citizen. who's standing up to help fulton county run an election. in the middle of the pandemic. >> but what he did was without a doubt unconstitutional. it was unpatriotic. it was fundamentally un-american. when he used the power of his -- -- a small business owner, a mother, a proud american citizen. who's standing up to help fulton county run an election. in the middle of the pandemic. >> but what he did was without a doubt unconstitutional. it was unpatriotic. it was fundamentally un-american. when he used the power of his presidency to put the enormous pressure on state, local, have veteran officials in his own
vice president. it became a downright dangerous. and generally sixth that pressure became deadly. ruby freeman says the president supposed to protect every american. not target them. and she is right. >> if the most powerful person in the world can bring the full weight of the presidency down on an ordinary citizen who was merely doing her job. with a lie as big as heavy as a mountain. who among us is safe? none of us is. none of us. >> after the break we will joined by arizona secretary of state, katie hobbs, who oversaw the election in one of the states trump targeted. mp targeted. it. usually. and in it. mostly. here to meet those high standards is the walgreens health and wellness brand. over 2000 high quality products. rigorously tested by us.
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the subaru forester has earned the i-i-h-s top safety pick plus eight times. more than honda c-r-v or toyota rav-four. love. it's what makes subaru, subaru. let's break down the trump pressure campaign on arizona fischel's. joining me is katie hobbs, the arizona secretary of state. she is running for governor of that great state. madam secretary, welcome. let's get your reaction off the
top two hearing that the arizona house speaker detailed that pressure campaign on him the way that he did. >> i don't think i realized how involved the pressure campaign was. obviously, republican officials got different kinds of pressure than democratic officials did. i did not get calls from giuliani, trump or his allies, but i did have armed protesters surrounded by home. that was a tactic that a lot of people experienced. i think what has become so clear from all of this is just the level of coordination that is involved not just in leading up to january six and the electoral college certification but that is continuing, these attacks on america and our democracy and the future of free and fair elections that are on the ballot for next november. >> it is interesting because despite the pressure, you have
rusty bowers, lay out trump and his allies really came after him to overturn the election, but then even after that, he says, he would still vote for trump again in 2024. from my perspective, that is a little bit nuts. how should we assess that? what does that say about all of this? >> i think rusty powers is an honorable man. he did the right thing in the situation under immense pressure. i think it is a sad commentary on the state of political affairs today that asking people to do the bare minimum, uphold their oath of office that they swore to the constitution's heroic, but that is where we are. >> it's an interesting space. i think a lot of people are still trying to figure that out. you also have a situation where rusty testified that arizona congressman andy biggs contacted him on january six to support the certification of
electors. what does that say to you that a member of the arizona congressional delegation was pushing for the suffer? >> i think it was clear from early on that both congressman bags and gosar were involved in this coordination. they were trying to cozy up to the former president and use their influence and relationship with the speaker to try to change his mind on this issue. thankfully, they were not able to. >> you have been also the subject of a lot of violence, threats of violence, since the 2020 election. what does it say to you -- or how did you take in listening to these officials recount the threats that they received? how have you processed all of this? >> it's certainly been extremely trying and one of the most daunting things about being a female in elected
office or politics today, i had armed protesters outside my home. i had state security detail a number of time, i private security now. nobody signs up for this. these people need to be held accountable. i think as long as they are not, this kind of violence and violent rhetoric is going to be the new norm in our political system. it is very unfortunate. >> you are making that run for governor. i am sure that you feel good about that, and things hopefully are going well for you, but you're republican component, at least a leading republican to opponent, terry lake, had called for you to be jailed and said that she would not have certified president biden's victory in arizona, if she were governor. this is not just a democrat versus republican race, is it? we are beyond the rubicon when it comes to where we are right now.
>> yeah, absolutely. this is a huge part of the reason that i am running for governor. as i mentioned before, democracy is on the ballot in 2022. you are seeing that play out in races across the country, with election deniers against -- arizona might be the premiere race in that situation. carey lake is making these claims with absolutely zero evidence. she is doing it to rile a purpose. what is really scary is that she has refused to say whether or not she would certify the 2024 election. we all know there is no legal basis for anyone to have not certified the 2020 election. so, this is going to be a tough fight. i need folks to join me at katie hobbs dot org, so that we are in a position to help continue protecting our democracy. >> secretary katie hobbs, i wish you well and thank you very much for being with us this evening. still ahead, the long journey someone will have to make in
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hundreds of miles or across state lines to obtain an abortion is nothing new, but now, the number of women who are i have to undergo a long journey is set to increase exponentially. and bc's yasmin vossoughian flew with a group of women from texas to new mexico, documenting their journey from across state lines. >> it's early in the morning,
and 20 young women me at a church in texas for one reason, they will travel to new mexico and get an abortion. >> i can't do this. i cannot put another kid with the two that already have. >> it is just not an option right now, not for me, not for him. there is no support system right now. >> today, what happens is you got to make a choice about your life. >> the new mexico religious coalition for reproductive choice and the first unitarian church of dallas -- >> adios, amigos. >> are helping this young woman leave texas, a state with one of the most restrictive abortion laws in the nation. >> we are arriving at the airport here in dallas. this is just the first leg in a very long day for so many of these women. >> we are about to make it law. >> texas has banned the medical procedure after six weeks, and now with federal protection for abortion rights gone, traveling across state lines will be the reality for so many women.
>> you want to get it done, but it is also like, i have to go to albuquerque. >> advocates of dispensing this as a major victory, hoping to institute similar laws with the overturn of roe. on this trip, all of the women are below the poverty line and 6 to 11 weeks pregnant. without help, they would not be able to make the journey. only memory and sally wanted to be filmed using first names. sally asked not to use her real name to protect their privacy. >> how do you guys feel like, one leg down, you are now here? >> it is almost over. it's just a little bit bizarre that we have to come all the way out here. >> dr. curtis boyd caught started this clinic in new mexico and another in dallas. he's one of the oldest abortion doctors in the country and says that he is determined to make sure that these women have a way out. >> you may swallow that with
some water. now, what i must tell you -- >> make it your choice but make it reasonable and wise. >> this is a decision that these women are making, according to their own faith and values. it is our duty as a faith rooted organization to trust what they heard from god and support it. >> half other women on this trip came across state lines to take a pill, the other half for a ten minute surgical procedure. >> we have women out there that have been raped. you have women that they don't have anybody, or they are with
the wrong person, or they are not ready. you cannot make women be ready for taking care of kids because that is a huge step. >> the church where these women began their journey fought for abortion rights before roe, helped roe v. wade to the supreme court and is now fighting the texas law. >> we will see a public health crisis in this country, but a lot of people don't even want to think about it because it doesn't affect them. what affects one effects another. this is where our faith also comes back into play. what i see is human life in front of me, and that is what is important. >> that was msnbc means yasmin vossoughian reporting. we still have a town to cover in the second hour of a man, focused on the big stories of the week. the supreme court's decision on abortion, the whiplash on gun control between congress and the court, and the