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tv   Inside Story  Al Jazeera  June 15, 2022 3:30am-4:01am AST

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right, monitor the referee, disallow the goal for a fowl in the build up his minds using it was with compounded after the break. constable recess since off, less than 10 minutes after coming on as a substitute. the yellow card has been cancelled. and it is now read. despite the numerical disadvantage you zealand continued to pressure their opponents goal. but costa rica held on to secure the wind and a place at the 6th world cup. with qualifying at an ends and all 32 places now accounted for the focus will shift back to the house, cat saw, and its final preparations for the middle east's. first, ever world cup the bits a hostess tournament was 112 years ago. they will finally kickoff, just over 5 months time. and he, richardson, al jazeera, doha, ah,
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you're with al jazeera, these are the top stories. now the 1st deportation flight that was supposed to take asylum seekers from the u. k to ra wonder, was cancelled after last minute intervention by the european court of human rights . several people's shadows are fly out, had earlier one individual appeals against their deportation. what british prime minister barak johnston has admitted that his government may need to change the law to ensure deportations can continue. we're trying to make a distinction between legal pathways to the u. k, which we support. we want people to bill to come here in fear of their lives. we want to do it legally and safely. and that's why we have all the safer legal roots that are open to, to people. what we want to do is to show the people traffickers, but that they're breaking the law. they're risking people's lives and it will work anyway. now, it will be necessary to change some laws to help us as we go along may very well.
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joe biden will include saudi arabia on the itinerary of his 1st middle east trip. as u. s. president, he's looking to reset the relationship at a time in the u. s. pushes for more oil to be pumped, to reduce high petrol prices. abiding has come under fire from somebody's own party for visiting saudi arabia. u. s. intelligence agencies concluded that crown prince mohammed been some man, ordered the murder of journalistic, jamal kashodi. the kingdom denies this. ukraine says its military is trying to get the last remaining civilians out of severity on the exc. russia is getting closer to taking over the eastern city as it tightens its grip on the dumbass region. on monday, russian forces destroyed the last bridge out of severity on the ask on that connects it with a neighboring city of the sea chance the french president has declared nato will do all it can to end russia's invasion of ukraine are conceding, no one knows what the conflict has in store, micron arrived in romania to begin
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a tour of eastern europe, which will also take into moldova. from the world. food program says it's suspending 8 to 1700000 people, south sudan because it doesn't have enough money already wide spread hundrend, starvation or being compounded by high food prices linked to the ukraine war. those are the headlines. the news continues. herron al jazeera, as after inside story. no said tis only change because some people believe in a post that is bigger than them. ah ha, among the middle of m a. c o m, as they represented, they put themselves on me to make the changes. some that we've done collectively has learned. it said, i've taken this long every retina women's got your music leg visit, we have this culture to slash and born to create new year areas. we have to change
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discounts. i'm one of the fortunate ones who can me on the subject myself outside. but all the people and on that majority these illegal or mr. talk about, just good, hardworking people that want to live the american dream like our ancestors. these were hinge and refugees are terrified. they may be forced to return to me and more the u. k. is set to the port asylum seekers to wander after legal challenges failed . it's a move described by many as inhumane. will it stop refugees reaching britain? this is inside story. ah.
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hello and welcome to the program. i'm how much am john? come here and we'll send you to a wanda, that's the message coming out of the united kingdom for asylum seekers and migrants trying to reach it illegally. most of the people who were supposed to be deported. we're able to avoid the 1st flight to kick golly through individual legal challenges, a request to halt the flight on ground. the deportations would undermine the dignity of people escaping warren oppression was rejected by the you case, court of appeal. laura burton, manley reports o, a chorus of anger from protesters outside london's court of appeal. as the judge gave the green light for the 1st flight of refugees of migrants, true wonder writes, good. say it includes people who had escaped war in afghanistan of syria and being flown more than 6000 kilometers away, will traumatized them further. they suffered incredibly, they've seen how many members killed they've,
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they've had talked to themselves and they are tired. but at the end of that heather, that finding detention incredibly show him a tie thing and thought of a fair, the deportation half way across the way. it is absolutely terrifying for them. you . k prime minister burse, johnson says a deportation strategy will undermine people's smuggling networks. and deter refugees from making dangerous journeys to britain. the united nations refugee agency hits back saying rwanda's human rights record is on the scrutiny. and the u . k is shirking responsibility. this is all wrong. this is all wrong. this deal, you know, it is the foundation of the right to asylum that people that are on it. countries territory, especially a country that is a signatory to the convention and has the institutions to deal with that. in april home secretary, pretty patel visited by golly,
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to finalize the project and potentially send tens of thousands of people them. the deal includes a payment of about $150000000.00 to the refund and government. so far this year, 10000 migrants refugees made the crossing from mainland to europe to the u. k. and 28000 last year in november, 27th people drowned when that ding deflated and many more that had to be rescued from the channels busy shipping lanes. some of those who risk their lives will leave on the 1st flight on tuesday. but there may not be many on it. a series of individual legal challenges mean only a few of the 130 people notified will leave. and the government continues to face pressure from activists rights groups and unions who insist the move is unlawful.
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oh, laura, that molly on to 0 are i was go and bring in our guests in london, where mostly is founder of care for kelly, an organization campaigning against the dissertation and kigali. joseph ry are asa is executive secretary of never again a social justice and peace building organization in ra, wanda, and in brussels. captain will are the secretary general of the european council on refugees and exiles, a warm welcome to wall and thanks for joining us. but 1st, we're going to talk to shabby a man to you and hcr spokesperson. she joins us from geneva. shabby. a thanks so much for joining us today. i want to ask you 1st about some of the remarks that were made by sleep grandy, the un high commissioner for refugees. he said that the precedent that this creates is catastrophic. so let me ask you, what kind of precedent does this plan between the u. k. and rwanda set
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well indeed, very worrying president, we've pronounced ourselves repeatedly on this issue. these types of arrangements, they undermine the whole principle of refugee protection of responsibility sharing . we're living in a world today where it's actually the countries, but some of the most under resource. they are in fact already the ones that are taking on the disproportionate learn of risk responsibilities. that they're in fact before the, the current situation with the ukraine war and the refugee displacement that we've seen from that particular situation. countries in the global south has stood about 85 percent of the world's refugees. now these countries off filling their obligations, they're protecting refugees. when you have countries that are more well resourced and not have the capacities to process asylum claims to receiver to jason, if they are shaking their obligations, what kind of message does that then? sure if at all joint or it's worrying from a legal perspective,
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but also from an ethical and moral perspective as well, shall be let me ask you about the fact that, you know, the fact that there is so much concern about this plan. does this plan to send asylum seekers or a wanda to be processed? is that not contradict the case obligations as a signatory to the international refugee convention? and then furthermore, what are the concerns specifically about rewan does ability to host and process these asylum seekers? well indeed we said that the syringe, my think to transfer refugees in the countries and the absence of god and found us they really what they do with shifts or responsibilities for asylum. they evade international obligations, and they are contrary to the 1st and the last of the refugee convention or in our country sure. of the law and the responsibilities that need to be met. but refugees, a fan to be there,
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not commodity cheese base human being the human life. they shouldn't have to be transferred to other countries. empty people who have international their afforded international protection standards. hammond to be refugees. they need to be protected. some of them have fled very traumatic experiences and circumstances. no one boland turley chooses to become a refugee, sir. they should not be shipped off against their will and treated like they, they can be traded. i mean, a human being, we're talking about a shabby at you and hcr also says this plan is an effort to export the countries legal obligations to provide asylum to those seeking a safe haven. tell us about some of the other concerns that you and your colleagues have about off shoring. well, that's what, what, what these arrangements are. they're basically out. so think internet tional legal responsibilities to other countries and, but it may go against the spirit and the letter of the lord way if we mentioned. so
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we need a more humane and compassionate approach in terms of dealing with this issue, we're talking about a very limited number of movements. and also these are their visit appropriate recalls as a way to deal with regime months. now, when you have a fair and efficient asylum process that can determine who is in need of international protections, or who was a refugee and who isn't some very manageable way of addressing this issue. and it's all about preventing the resort of refugees as well too dangerous and risky chinese phase models have been captured as a deterrent. but this is not really what is going to be the result of these arrangements were undermining legal obligation, but also replacing refugees at risk. and at the same time, you're going to people shake even more dangerous and risky journeys to safety. in the absence of those pathways to safety, all right, man to spokes person for the you in refugee agency. thanks so much for joining us
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on inside story. claire, let me turn to you now. i just want to take a step back for a moment and talk about the human beings who are being impacted by all of this. you know, many of these refugees migrants asylum seekers. they were already severely traumatized . so as somebody who works directly with them, how scared are these refugees and migrants who are facing the possibility that they might now get center a wanda we've been talking to them for the last couple of weeks and it would be impossible lady to interstate how sad and traumatized by they are by this, as she say, these people are victims of the worst things happen around the world. 5 of them of victims of trafficking, which will check, they've all suffered horrible things. they say no harmony's cold. they have been traumatized in south. i conflicts and torture and they have the most horrible
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physical i'm mentions, oz. one of them has been diagnosed with these yesterday. and just being in detention as in highly traumatic for them. some of them being in detention reminds them of, of the times and they have been locked away until chit. they are terrified at being center one that they're terrified at the repercussions themselves on the terrified what's gonna happen to their families. and 2 of them are each 2 of them have family members in the u. k that they now feel like they will be name. and none of them from africa that say it for them, it represents the intention of the continent. they have no connection to. we had evidence in court that may certainty that people from that at least will gratify hearing adam claims and miranda. so for them, it's just incredibly traumatic and we're talking about people like i say, you already have extreme physical and mental scars from that previous experiences. so this plan is obsolete. a bristol, what we're going to put these people say it can't be taken back and in court,
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they sat in the future. it's found that this plan is a loafer. well, we'll just bring them back. but we can't take a holler and the breach hello. see what we changed them as human beings. we can't just say, sorry for that. you know, it's impossible to ex, hers, not home. catherine. there been many british officials who have stated on numerous occasions that off showing refugees does not in their opinion contravene for you in refugee convention up. but there are many rights activists and advocates out there who say that is simply not the case from your vantage point. is this action by the u. k. a contravention of international law? we would say it certainly is. and in saying that we're in agreement with you and hcr, which is the authority on the interpretation of the refugee convention. and that is the basis of international refugee law. i would highlight 2 elements,
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2 articles of the convention, article 33, which is the prohibition of reform mom to send people back to a place where their lives are at risk. and it may be the case or that given that rwanda's asylum system is embryonic, as you and hcr has analyzed that people don't get protection and then are sent back to countries where they're at risk. there's also article $31.00 which prohibits states that a signatures to the convention from discriminating against people on the basis of the manner of their arrival. so this policy in general, in the u. k. many elements of the new boat as act. but also this particular deal appears to contravene that part of international refugee law, which says that people shouldn't be treated differently according to how they arrive. and it's not illegal to cross borders to seek protection. and we would underline the large majority of those arriving in the u. k. having crossed the
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channel all found to be in need of international protection. so it's a group of people, many of whom refugees in need, of international protection and who shouldn't be penalized for the way that they've been forced to arrive in the u. k. joseph, as katherine just mentioned, the you and hcr has said that rwanda does not have the capacity to process these asylum claims, and that there is a risk of some migrant could be returned to countries from which they fled. what's your response to that? yo us. thanks a lot. i think i it depends on ah, which goose creek area though you in a series the best on making love. ah, ah notices but her. what i can search for the last or 20, i'll one does the sooner if you do and are on the come up where now
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i africans from north africa, we are being ah, ah, mistreated lorenzo trailed to cross the mo, the material now. awesome. saw out. so that i wonder are, has the capacity to process that a she do? i am a catherine. let me get back to you about one of the points that joseph was making . and he was saying that that were wanda, is able to do this. you know, many officials and want to have said that it is a safe country that they are welcoming to refugees and migrants from your point of view. you stated earlier that, that essentially, you know, it's embryonic as far as their being able to process this many asylum seekers. or do you think that they will be able to, to get to the point where they can process this. and also why was were wonder selected. so i think that number of different factors to mention. first of
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all, we would defer to you and hcr in its assessment of the asylum system in rwanda. in terms of the situation in rwanda more generally are, we know that even the u. k. government itself has noted in some of its reports that there are questions about the respect for human rights in rwanda. so that is something that also should be taken into account. and the, the reason a country enters into this kind of deal is for the benefits that they receive. and there's been a lot of publicity about the amount of money that will be provided to rwanda. and it's also a country where the leader, who likes to act as a provocateur in many senses and to, to go against the grain. and so that may be one of the reasons why this country, in particular, has decided to enter into a deal when so many other countries refused to do so, because they don't want to take on the responsibilities of
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a country like the u. k which has its international obligations and both has the means and the obligations to be offering protection to the small number of displaced people that actually arrived there in the u. k. so i think that's part of it. these kind of agreements as well as the money they also gave us so to political leverage, because it creates dependency on the country that's hosting people. so we see that, for instance, in the arrangements between the e. u and turkey, which we also condemn, that gives political leverage to, in that case a political leader who is able to put pressure on europe and extract concessions because of hosting in that case far greater number of people. so those are the kind of factors that are involved, and i would underline that as well as the human rights considerations, one of the object since to the day at least the cost. it looks massively expensive,
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which is what sells. have been learned from the use of this kind of model in australia. claire, let me ask you about what legal avenues are left right now when it comes to challenging this plan. as i understand it, there is going to be age additional review in the next month with regard to this new policy. if, if the opinion of the next additional review were to be that this policy is flawed, or if it is not illegal, would those who may have been transferred already to a want to be eligible to come back to the u. k? yes, the, the important hearing is the one in july, which is when the court will look at whether the policy is impact lawful. and if the court decides that isn't and yes, we can bring them back am. but the extreme damage that was injured is incredibly concerning. and a lot of people say so us, they're such a run that they will kill themselves. and i really don't know why that would leave
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us, you know, and the damage that we just individuals by the quotation and to that amazed. that's not something that we can either take ac is that and it's very hard for us to understand bio guzman is carrying down the street. when there are other things that we could do that would a much more humane. and i would say much more active if we gave baez's to people in halley and other refugees, same as we did he grain ins. and that would put people smugglers out business, and that would stop people risk analysis in the channel. so i, we find it incredibly difficult to understand by the british government would go down a bit that is so incredibly bristol and dangerous, and cruel to refugees on this other options that are available. it would probably be more effective as one. no, he name joseph. um, i'll let you finish with the, the point that you were making earlier. but i also want to ask you about the fact, you know, we're wandering officials of said the country has a proud history of welcoming those in need. and that rwanda is already home to more
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than a 130000 refugees and migrants from other african nations and other countries as well. you know, with there are a lot of activists and, and refugee advocates. others say that the refugees of migrants who sought better lives in britain are expected to find fewer chances to pursue their dreams in rwanda. what would you say to that in the yeah, no, i think for the other as i was saying previous, is that i wonder has the capacity of mission. they have a lot more than one thought to tell them to do. so. the contrast taking care of the literacy do so i think ronda has the capacity of the country. so coming back to what you're saying, i think that is some i'll be some good a sort of but i think there's some by us from, from, from the north where people think that countries in the, in the global south, dont have maybe we, we are still the dock will they be the but it's not functioning systems,
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but i can i can, they can be a bottle so that i think rwanda is ronda has it has created an opportunity given its history. it has created opportunities to each and every person. it is stuck to one of what was buckled on. we'll have a grown so and, and on. and i think ah, what the other up to this form, the global north are saying, it's just a bias of. uh huh. they have and they'd be on africa or all other countries in the, in the, in the global house. but i would say i rhonda has a chisel and as potent press systems to be able to support the process and also make this clear. i think you can, the government has the right to get into and a partnership with a country which they think they can the,
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the common kind of the tip they were government to process the asylum seekers saw bringing the car in the was to under. it doesn't mean that the process has ended the process, the process will continue. so it's, it's a try that. so i think that people should enter go, could create mountain local. this is catherine. how concerned are you about the possibility that a refugee who faces a real risk of persecution could be refused asylum in rwanda. and then what, what happened? so that according to the memorandum of understanding, that is the basis of this agreement. and we should know that this is also one of the problems here. it's not a, an international agreement. it's the in the form of a memorandum of understanding and informal flimsy kind of a quarter agreement between the u. k. a. rwanda,
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which was that makes it more difficult to challenge legally. and so in that memorandum of understanding there are points that mentioned that rwanda will be able to send people onwards. so people who are, are not, and didn't, did not receive a positive decision after and assigning prices in rwanda may be sent back to their and countries or to other countries. so there's the risk of course of reform, all that they would be sent back to their countries where they faced persecution. as i said earlier, the vast majority of those arriving currently in the u. k. across the channel are people in need of international protection, according to the u. k. cause. so there is as a strong risk there, that if somebody gets a negative decision in an asylum system which is are under construction, let's say that they're sent and, and refilled. and the other question is this part of the agreement that potentially
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allows them to be sent somewhere else? so is there a risk that they're then sent to another country that's cooperating with rwanda and, and where they may also face or other issues. but i think it's not, it's not a question of what, what, what tire assessment is of rwanda, as i said, we defer to you and hcr on that. i think it's also about the fact that the u. k. has international obligations and responsibilities and, and it is undermining international refugee lobe, international law, more generally by entering this kind of agreement. so it, it encourages allan countries in the rich world to undermine international law and to attempt to circumvent their own obligations. claire, we just have about a minute left. just briefly, you know, boris johnson says that this is going to break the business model of criminal gangs
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. let me ask you 1st. do you think that's the case? and, and this is, is this something that's actually going to deter migration because people are still getting on board. we were still risking their lives? yeah, unfortunately, i think it's pretty clear that it's not, i should say people are still crossing. and the british government has tried a number of policies, parents, and none of them have had any effect at all. so even though it is more reasonable than any other, it isn't a fax to policy. so why should s succeed when any of the files of that why? why if the government will show that they want to be people's, why would they try now? why would they try something new if that's ready or other ways to do it, it would be more than more humane. all right, well we have run out of time, so we're going to have to leave the discussion there. thanks so much to all of our guests. claire mostly, joseph ry, rasa, and katherine willard. and thank you for watching. you can see the program again
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any time by visiting our website, l 0 dot com. and for further discussion, go to our facebook page. that's facebook dot com, forward slash ha inside story. you can also join the conversation on twitter or handle this at adrian. so i story from him how much i'm feeling the whole team here and i for now. ah, the latest news, as it breaks there, an estimated $20000.00 li gold miners just in the younger mom, the reservation with detailed coverage and the government says it's taking action, but not the lives are being put in danger from around the world. residents, zalinski says the coming days will be crucial for ukraine will be expected, renew, defensive in
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